Announcing pfSense plus
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@johnpoz said in Announcing pfSense plus:
That wording really sounds like pfsense CE could just die off.. I don't like that wording at all.. And prob going to throw up the most red flags to the community at large..
I agree! Sounds like "either community takes over the job or it will die slowly when no new updates from Plus will get downported".
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Will try to address this the best I can
As stated in the blog we will continue to provide updates to CE around security vulnerability protection, FreeBSD related updates, common code, etc. So pfSense users are free to stay on pfSense CE, particularly if they place a premium on openness.
At the same time, our customers are asking for newer, greater value. We will deliver. But, through a Netgate product, with Netgate value-add meant for Netgate customers. In addition, we will also provide this value to home and lab users at no cost. As everyone knows, it's certainly not free for us to build products. We think a value-exchange is fair.
While no one is forced to become a customer, we do welcome all who choose to become one.
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@dennis_s said in Announcing pfSense plus:
As stated in the blog we will continue to provide updates to CE around security vulnerability protection, FreeBSD related updates, common code, etc. So pfSense users are free to stay on pfSense CE, particularly if they place a premium on openness.
I think the main point that you'll get measured by people is: If you are still driving updates on CE (or backport them from Plus) or if the OSS variant will get a slow silent death. Additionally so, as there was almost no real "outside" developers that are that deep into pfSense CE codebase/building that "community" could even take over (in my understanding at least).
Many projects (initially at least) got a commercial "step-brother". Nagios or others hop in mind, where "of course, OSS variant was still there" but the main development was into the paying Nagios3 enterprise product and the free core got almost no love for quite a long time until the community break-off with Icinga did happen. I think that's the point where all of us are looking how you will progress further after 2.5 (and 2.6). Because no one wants another fork or split of communities :)
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@dennis_s said in Announcing pfSense plus:
We think a value-exchange is fair.
Agreed.
Some people will be happy with the closed source version, others will be happy with a free feature-limited open source version. But some people would be willing to pay to get the best of both worlds: a product that is full-featured and open source. But Netgate is not offering that product so those people will be forced to find it elsewhere. I think this is the end of something and the beginning of something else. -
@jeremy11one said in Announcing pfSense plus:
But some people would be willing to pay to get the best of both worlds: a product that is full-featured and open source.
Ah missed that one in my answer above. Yes, that's exactly one point. As last year was quite a happening in terms of cyber security if we look at things like Citrix fails, Fortigate, etc. etc. a main point in having such a strong (selling) base for pfSense IS the OSS point. Otherwise it's just another "closed source enterprise product" for many of those, that want to switch. May it be as good as it is.
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I think maybe it could just be worded a bit differently.. From reading that - it does sound like CE could just die..
I really didn't get that impression from our talk, but the wording of that does not sound good for future of CE.. Just my take on it, and seems a few others as well.
I really don't have concern personally, because I don't really plan on not having a netgate appliance ;) I love my 4860 and can't really see not just buying whatever current model is out when it reaches end of life. So + is fine with me, and I don't have a personal issue with closed source either. Not like I ever compiled pfsense on my own ;) Closest I came is when compiled dhcp client from freebsd with change for hop count (TTL) and provided that to users that were having a problem. After bug report was filed with freebsd by me.
And from my take, and you can run pfsense + on your own hardware with home/lab license sort of thing.. But the wording in the faq kind of screams the end of anything new for CE.. But from our talk - took it that stuff would be ported to CE from FE..
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I might get vilified for saying these things, so be it.
I am going to give credit to Netgate for being honest today. They havenāt tried to talk circles around what is going on. The CE edition is not going to be a priority for them after v2.5. That's just the way it is.
Iām not Richard Stallman, Iām not a FOSS purist. I use pfSense at home. It works very well for my purposes. Iāve learned a lot by both trying things until itās not broken and from those much more experienced than I on the forum. Itās been a very positive experience. I expect that I will continue to use and learn while using the plus version. This will have very little real impact on me.
Look, Iām just a guy who uses this at home. If pfSense vanished next week Iād be just fine, a little disappointed maybe. I donāt have any skin in this game and Iām not inclined to be critical of Netgate for making the business decisions they feel are best for their business and their customers.
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Actually, this sounds great. I had been thinking about this mainly for guys, such as, BBCAN177 and BMeeks.
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@dennis_s said in Announcing pfSense plus:
We think a value-exchange is fair.
100% ACK
That's why I'm asking for the gold membership again.
Open Source is in one oft the best benefits of pfSense. -
Personally I find it sad that pfSense CE and the paid options are going to diverge re. their code bases, because that means that people that otherwise would contribute with fixes etc. (because of the openness of the source code) now will feel less enthusiastic about contributing.
How can I say state that? Well I have previously contributed fixes etc. for dhcpv6 - primary for handling leases in the GUI. I must say that this really feels like a downer to me.Does the management think that closing the source code on new development will put more trust into the product seen from the perspective of the users?
Now, seen from the outside, it will become easier for 3 and 4 letter organisations to get code pushed into the product.
How will you convince users that they can keep investing time into using pfSense regardless if they consider using CE, the paid options or contributing code fixes etc. when they are less likely to be allowed to browse the (up-to-date) source code? -
While this seems to be focused on Netgate's appliances, will it cover the whole line, including the SG-1100?
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@mlines said in Announcing pfSense plus:
While this seems to be focused on Netgate's appliances, will it cover the whole line, including the SG-1100?
In addiction to this question, how is going to be releases once netgate hardware is EOL?
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@mcury said in Announcing pfSense plus:
@mlines said in Announcing pfSense plus:
While this seems to be focused on Netgate's appliances, will it cover the whole line, including the SG-1100?
In addiction to this question, how is going to be releases once netgate hardware is EOL?
I meant, in addition to the question, for an unknown reason I can't edit the previous post.
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@mlines Yes the SG-1100 will be included.
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@mcury From what I understand right now you should be able to get pfSense plus on all Netgate appliances. Keep an eye on our product lifecycle page for more info later on how it works with EOL appliances.
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Will review prices for my sg 3100 when avail
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It's my understanding that if you own a Netgate appliance, plus is free.
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Even if yet was announced, that there will be a no-charge path for home and lab use, I really hope that will be the way we are going in the next years.
I am also ready to pay for a great software for my private-home-network. It is my hobby, I love PFSense, but the costs -IF in the future there will be a charge for privat users- must be adequate. Like 5$ per month would be fair in my opinion.
But if the version, even for home user would for example be limited to 50 IP adresses (like Sophos) or a charge of XXX$ or XXXX$ would be billed annualy, you would lose many private folks.
And nowadays, especially with smart-home, guest-wifi for your friends, you hit the 50 IP adresses fast.Just that as general thought for your future-briefings.
At the moment it looks great: Plus version, without charge for privat & lab use! Thumbs up!
But IF in the next years you are going to charge the home users, pls keep it in a fair way, to allow the nerds, like me, using that great project. Would be really sad, to move to another platform. -
@jeremy11one said in Announcing pfSense plus:
I think it's important for everyone to know about these 2 things from the FAQ page:***Q: So there are no more new releases from the project?
A: That is really up to how the project progresses itself, separate and distinct from Netgate... If the community chooses to progress feature set, testing, documentation, and release packaging, there will obviously be progression beyond Release 2.5.Q: Is pfSense Plus open source?
A: No. pfSense Plus is closed source.One of the big benefits of pfSense was that it is open source. Even though the upgrade to pfSense Plus is expected to be free for home users, I'm torn about whether to "upgrade" to the newer closed source version or stay with the open source CE version.
I have a "Bad feeling" about these statement too.
While i do understand Netgate is a buisiness.
I can't stop feeling like CE is going to be "abandoned" / "Left as is".I'm not a developer, and have tried to "pay back" by helping out on the forum instead.
But who in the community can lift the task of improving CE ?
Isn't all the "core developers" with Netgate ?/Bingo
Ps:
If i were a Whale , i'd think of this sentence:
"Goodbye and thanx for all the fish" -
pfSense is going closed source in the mid/long run? That is really the worst thing that could happen. :-(
-Rico
