NTP Issue
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@ARAMP1
can you try this?[23.09.1-RELEASE][root@pfSense.kiokoman.home]/root: ntpdate -4 -d 192.168.10.200 11 Dec 19:02:31 ntpdate[90565]: ntpdate 4.2.8p17@1.4004-o Fri Oct 6 04:49:28 UTC 2023 (1) transmit(192.168.10.200) receive(192.168.10.200) transmit(192.168.10.200) receive(192.168.10.200) transmit(192.168.10.200) receive(192.168.10.200) transmit(192.168.10.200) receive(192.168.10.200) server 192.168.10.200, port 123 stratum 1, precision -20, leap 00, trust 000 refid [GPS], root delay 0.000000, root dispersion 0.050781 reference time: e921cd07.c6d512e4 Mon, Dec 11 2023 19:01:43.776 originate timestamp: e921cd3d.75978b8d Mon, Dec 11 2023 19:02:37.459 transmit timestamp: e921cd3d.75888e26 Mon, Dec 11 2023 19:02:37.459 filter delay: 0.02597 0.02596 0.02596 0.02927 ---- ---- ---- ---- filter offset: -0.000026 -0.000005 -0.000060 -0.001640 ---- ---- ---- ---- delay 0.02596, dispersion 0.00021, offset -0.000005 11 Dec 19:02:37 ntpdate[90565]: adjust time server 192.168.10.200 offset -0.000005 secchange the ip with your ntp server
Here's what I get:
11 Dec 13:42:23 ntpdate[40581]: ntpdate 4.2.8p17@1.4004-o Fri Nov 17 14:48:54 UTC 2023 (1)
transmit(192.168.10.120)
receive(192.168.10.120)
transmit(192.168.10.120)
receive(192.168.10.120)
transmit(192.168.10.120)
receive(192.168.10.120)
transmit(192.168.10.120)
receive(192.168.10.120)server 192.168.10.120, port 123
stratum 1, precision -18, leap 00, trust 000
refid [PPS], root delay 0.000000, root dispersion 0.000000
reference time: e921e4a5.00000000 Mon, Dec 11 2023 13:42:29.000
originate timestamp: e921e4a5.c5604188 Mon, Dec 11 2023 13:42:29.771
transmit timestamp: e921e4a5.c5f7503b Mon, Dec 11 2023 13:42:29.773
filter delay: 0.02501 0.02515 0.02541 0.02478
---- ---- ---- ----
filter offset: -0.002827 -0.002754 -0.002617 -0.002893
---- ---- ---- ----
delay 0.02478, dispersion 0.00009, offset -0.00289311 Dec 13:42:29 ntpdate[40581]: adjust time server 192.168.10.120 offset -0.002893 sec
I see yours is showing GPS and mine is showing PPS
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@ARAMP1
I think it's just a label or the way I configured my ntpsec, either way this shows that pfsense is able to communicate with your ntp server on port 123the only way for me to have a Unreach/Pending state is when i select an isolated interface that is unable to reach my ntp server.
did you try to change the interface where it's listening? like localhost only ? -
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@ARAMP1 sounds like the same issue I have with the plus version 23.09:
https://forum.netgate.com/post/1136805
NTP works again going back to previous version (23.05.01)
I just read through your thread again. I noticed that you were able to point specific machines to the IP address of your NTP server and bypass pfSense. I really want/need a windows machine that I run Blue Iris on and all of my security cameras to be synced, so I did that for that windows machine and it works fine.
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They have a Redmine open for NTP authentication issues I think the patch that Marcos and Matthew merged might also fix this. The GitHub was merged a couple days ago but has not been looked at but it looked to incorporate many fixes not just authentication issues.
https://redmine.pfsense.org/issues/8794
https://github.com/pfsense/pfsense/commit/847e417b5612f28bc1e84ca028a980df9c5c57a7
Make sure to upvote
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@ARAMP1
Well, it's taken me quite a few hours to get to this post.
I went to check my time precision this morning and noticed that the graphs were all way out.
Checking when it started, it was right after I upgraded to 2.7.2.
Looking at my local Stratum 1 NTP server, it's pending/unreachable and the firewall has fallen back to time.apple.comWith the basics checked, then ACL's adjusted and even firewall rules put in, the ntpupdate -4 command showed that everything is working as it should. (And likely was before I did anything other than upgrade...)
pfsense just refuses to accept any NTP traffic from the LAN side of the house.
Right when I was starting to think it couldn't be much else than a system issue, I found this thread.
As well as confirming that some of us take time seriously, it was nice to know that we've got the same issue.Looks like a roll back is in order, or just wait for the patch
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Looks like a roll back is in order, or just wait for the patch
Even though there are issues with this (and also the ARP table showing permanent entries), I've decided to keep it at 2.7.2. I still show a stratum 1 using the nist.gov clocks. The only issue would be if the internet goes down. If it becomes an issue with individual machines, I'll direct them to my local NTP server then.
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just to pile on one more, I have the same issue on 23.09.1 on two 6100s with a local TM2000 on the same lan. I tried all of the things mentioned in these threads with no changes. It looks like it broke on 23.09 for me as well (after reviewing the RRD after I noticed the issue).
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@JonathanLee said in NTP Issue:
They have a Redmine open for NTP authentication issues I think the patch that Marcos and Matthew merged might also fix this.
I just played around a bit with this and couldn't get it to work.
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@JonathanLee said in NTP Issue:
They have a Redmine open for NTP authentication issues I think the patch that Marcos and Matthew merged might also fix this.
I just played around a bit with this and couldn't get it to work.
it is not fixed, also not able to get it to work in 24.03
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Seems the newer versions of software function by way of a different pair of spectacles. I have a number of issues versus older reliable versions. I can tell you I personally like the old software better, it functions and feels far more resilient. I wonder why, I really do. I shouldn’t feel less trust with the new software. Again I hate to admit it’s starting to feel like that. Leading to, I shouldn’t feel afraid to upgrade. I use to get excited about even upgrade, now I question what is going to be broken if I upgrade. I am fearful of updates. Weird right? Is it big tech influence? Who knows, maybe I am just paranoid and don’t want to risk it now that I have it working way I want. Sorry it isn’t working
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@JonathanLee said in NTP Issue:
Seems the newer versions of software function by way of a different pair of spectacles. I have a number of issues versus older reliable versions. I can tell you I personally like the old software better, it functions and feels far more resilient. I wonder why, I really do. I shouldn’t feel less trust with the new software. Again I hate to admit it’s starting to feel like that. Leading to, I shouldn’t feel afraid to upgrade. I use to get excited about even upgrade, now I question what is going to be broken if I upgrade. I am fearful of updates. Weird right? Is it big tech influence? Who knows, maybe I am just paranoid and don’t want to risk it now that I have it working way I want. Sorry it isn’t working
Fully agreed!
That's the reason why I did not upgraded all my boxes yet.
Firewall software with a bad gut feeling is a "no go" (for me).
So I am started to thinking about changing the system with the next (hardware) cycle.... -
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So I am started to thinking about changing the system with the next (hardware) cycle....
What you are thinking to go with?
OPNSense, OpenWRT, RouterOS, VyOS, ClearOS, Untangle,......To be honest, not sure yet. Just started thinking about it....
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To be honest, not sure yet. Just started thinking about it....
I ordered some parts for setting up a tiny LAN server to free pfSense from
some tasks or services. Its nearly 200ish € but its worth in my eyes.RaspBerry PI 4 B (8GB)
GPS hat (u.blox M8)
Micro SD card 64 GB
mSATA board x857
active magnetic GSP antenna (5 meter cable)
USB C - PSULater it should run the following services;
- PI hole or CrowdSec
- syslog-ng server
- NTP (Internet, RTC, GPS)
- RadiusServer (FreeRadius)
- LDAP server (OpenLDAP)
Eventually later a DCF77 kit over USB but this is actually only brainstorming.
So for the entire network it will be then a Stratum1 NTP server with RTC,
GPS and over the internet with 4 pools and 4 servers. -
I just played around a bit with this and couldn't get it to work.
And what did you play with? Can we see your config? Can we see your ntp log? Can we see a simple sniff, you say it works via just using ntp out on the internet. Can we see sniff of that working?
I have been running a pi as my ntp server via a gps hat and yeah it would use pps as the source. For years, multiple versions of pfsense back to pre + days, And currently have a 2.7.2 pfsense as well as 23.09.1 and not having any issues syncing with my pi ntp server.
Are you trying to use auth? To your ntp - you say none of your other devices have any issues syncing with your ntp server? Can we see this output?
example
$ ntpq ntpq> pe remote refid st t when poll reach delay offset jitter ============================================================================== *ntp.home.arpa .PPS. 1 u 57 128 377 1.542 +0.376 0.193 ntpq>My windows box sync with my pi, here is pfsense
[23.09.1-RELEASE][admin@sg4860.home.arpa]/root: ntpq ntpq> pe remote refid st t when poll reach delay offset jitter ============================================================================== *ntp.home.arpa .PPS. 1 u 137 512 377 0.449 -0.741 0.189 ntpq>What are you using as your ntp server, ntpsec, chrony, just the plain jane ntp from ntp.org?
If there was some inherent bug/issue with ntp sync then you would think there would be many posts about it.. Since there does not seem to be - this points to something unique in your setup that is problematic, etc..
here is my settings, where 192.168.3.32 is my pi ntp box.. Which is running ntpsec
Here is my pi output
pi@pi-ntp:~ $ ntpq ntpq> pe remote refid st t when poll reach delay offset jitter ======================================================================================================= *SHM(1) .PPS. 0 l 2 16 377 0.0000 -0.6487 0.0136 -SHM(0) .GPS. 0 l 42 64 377 0.0000 -150.638 1.3091 +ntp-0.gw.illinois.edu 200.7.224.32 2 u 6 64 377 12.1672 2.2484 1.0747 +ntp.your.org .GPS. 1 u 41 64 377 10.5027 2.4140 0.7471 -tock.usshc.com .WAAS. 1 u 37 64 377 16.0153 1.7570 0.6719 -ntp1.netwrx1.com 24.196.111.36 2 u 33 64 377 37.7684 -2.0801 1.9852 ntpq> version ntpsec-1.2.1+85-g1a7bb2e3a ntpq>edit: my 2.7.2 box was off, just booted it - and can see right away that it can talk to my ntp server.. as reach is counting up
edit2: just booted my 24.03 and pointed it to my ntp server and bam its talking to it as you can see reach is counting up as well
here is a pcap of pfsense 3.253 talking to the ntp server 3.32
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SG-4860 24.03 | Lab VMs 2.7.2, 24.03 -
If there was some inherent bug/issue with ntp sync then you would think there would be many posts about it.. Since there does not seem to be - this points to something unique in your setup that is problematic, etc..
well, there are 3 or 4 post addressing that issue and a few people hopped on each thread.
The problem is, that NTP works but not with all NTP servers. The latter one is the issue. So it is not an issue with NTP itself.
We went thru all config options and other options (e.g. delete config and start over again etc) in the named threads.The main point is, NTP worked with the mentioned specifc server type (which are also working with all other clients) in 23.05 / 23.05.01 and stopped working in 23.09 (NTP works again going back to 23.05). And still not works with 24.03.
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well, there are 3 or 4 post addressing that issue and a few people hopped on each thread.
Lets see out of how many 1000's and 10s of 1000's of pfsense deployments? I am on here way too much, and I am not seeing these posts..
There may well be a bug/issue - but without some actual specifics of the users setup to find something common, users chiming in with me too.. Are of zero help.. For all we know they have some simple misconfiguration.. Like wrong IP address of their ntp server for gosh sake..
the only way to track down what your problem is with info.. Not I play with some stuff and couldn't get it to work ;)
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@johnpoz guess, all infos can be found here: https://forum.netgate.com/topic/184170/23-09-local-ntp-server-unrechable-worked-with-23-05-1
another thread (besides this one) is here (in German) https://forum.netgate.com/post/1137308
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I just played around a bit with this and couldn't get it to work.
And what did you play with? Can we see your config? Can we see your ntp log? Can we see a simple sniff, you say it works via just using ntp out on the internet. Can we see sniff of that working?
I have been running a pi as my ntp server via a gps hat and yeah it would use pps as the source. For years, multiple versions of pfsense back to pre + days, And currently have a 2.7.2 pfsense as well as 23.09.1 and not having any issues syncing with my pi ntp server.
Are you trying to use auth? To your ntp - you say none of your other devices have any issues syncing with your ntp server? Can we see this output?
example
$ ntpq ntpq> pe remote refid st t when poll reach delay offset jitter ============================================================================== *ntp.home.arpa .PPS. 1 u 57 128 377 1.542 +0.376 0.193 ntpq>My windows box sync with my pi, here is pfsense
[23.09.1-RELEASE][admin@sg4860.home.arpa]/root: ntpq ntpq> pe remote refid st t when poll reach delay offset jitter ============================================================================== *ntp.home.arpa .PPS. 1 u 137 512 377 0.449 -0.741 0.189 ntpq>What are you using as your ntp server, ntpsec, chrony, just the plain jane ntp from ntp.org?
If there was some inherent bug/issue with ntp sync then you would think there would be many posts about it.. Since there does not seem to be - this points to something unique in your setup that is problematic, etc..
here is my settings, where 192.168.3.32 is my pi ntp box.. Which is running ntpsec
Here is my pi output
pi@pi-ntp:~ $ ntpq ntpq> pe remote refid st t when poll reach delay offset jitter ======================================================================================================= *SHM(1) .PPS. 0 l 2 16 377 0.0000 -0.6487 0.0136 -SHM(0) .GPS. 0 l 42 64 377 0.0000 -150.638 1.3091 +ntp-0.gw.illinois.edu 200.7.224.32 2 u 6 64 377 12.1672 2.2484 1.0747 +ntp.your.org .GPS. 1 u 41 64 377 10.5027 2.4140 0.7471 -tock.usshc.com .WAAS. 1 u 37 64 377 16.0153 1.7570 0.6719 -ntp1.netwrx1.com 24.196.111.36 2 u 33 64 377 37.7684 -2.0801 1.9852 ntpq> version ntpsec-1.2.1+85-g1a7bb2e3a ntpq>edit: my 2.7.2 box was off, just booted it - and can see right away that it can talk to my ntp server.. as reach is counting up
edit2: just booted my 24.03 and pointed it to my ntp server and bam its talking to it as you can see reach is counting up as well
here is a pcap of pfsense 3.253 talking to the ntp server 3.32
Oh, I'd bet it's 100% user error, just want to figure out where.
It appears I have it set up like yours.
I'm using one of those chinese ebay boxes. I've had it running fine in pfSense for about 3 years now.
Here are the logs related to the server at 192.168.10.120
Jun 2 12:45:34 ntpd 8952 192.168.10.120 local addr 192.168.10.1 -> <null>
Jun 2 12:06:10 ntpd 15912 192.168.10.120 local addr 192.168.10.1 -> <null>
Jun 2 12:04:11 ntpd 15912 192.168.10.120 8011 81 mobilize assoc 17918
Jun 2 12:45:34 ntpd 75278 192.168.10.120 8011 81 mobilize assoc 23975
Jun 2 12:06:21 ntpd 8952 192.168.10.120 8011 81 mobilize assoc 59753
Jun 2 12:06:10 ntpd 15912 192.168.10.120 8012 82 demobilize assoc 17918
Jun 2 12:45:34 ntpd 8952 192.168.10.120 8012 82 demobilize assoc 59753
