GUI "Save" Button Inconsistency
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if anyone is whinging it's jimp! the rest of us are trying to point out things that might improve the user interface. if you like it the way it is, fine! but you don't have to run down and make fun of the very people who trying to make a great product even better.
Roy…
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Not really whinging, I just keep pointing out that it's a no-win conversation. Everyone will have differing opinions on this. What one person thinks is great, others won't like. You can't please everyone.
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I wouldn't want that though, often I want to make a batch of firewall rule changes (perhaps one of which might disrupt traffic flow, but the final result wouldn't) and then apply them all at once.
It would be possible in some cases to have a Save button (to write to config file) and a Save and Apply button (to write to current config file and apply to running system).
I'm not sure how some things would fit into this scheme. For example, on changing firewall rules should an apply also reset firewall states? Or should there be a Save, Reset and Apply button? Or should the possible need to reset states be something users should just know?
Current conventions probably make sense to developers and longer term users but, in some cases, confuse (even bewilder) new users and that can lead to the product developing a reputation as "difficult".
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I think having the buttons change between save, save and apply, etc, would confuse even more. Adding more buttons rarely eases confusion…
The apply changes button, when needed, shows up big and bright on the top of the screen... can't miss it. I still fail to see what might be confusing about that. I guess that's me though.
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The apply changes button, when needed, shows up big and bright on the top of the screen… can't miss it. I still fail to see what might be confusing about that. I guess that's me though.
Maybe one thing. What does really "Apply" when you push the button? If you ignore apply button because you know you are going to do more tasks involving other "apply events" in different menus. Is the apply for firewall rules just making firewall to apply or does it involve any applies that the system needs to do?
// rancor
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Most of the time, Apply means that it does a filter reload. Which means it regenerates and reloads the filter rules. For some other areas (like IPsec) it means it will re-write the configuration files for that section, restart the daemon, and then do a filter reload.
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so when a page has both an Apply and a Save, do I need to do both? also, why does hitting Save on some screens make the Apply button appear?
Roy…
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I'm can't see any pages that have both a Save and an Apply next to each other - care to provide an example?
And as to why hitting Save makes an Apply appear on some pages, that's been covered several times over in this thread. Typically it means a filter reload is needed, or in some cases it may let you make changes (like in IPsec) and apply them before the daemon is restarted.
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Interfaces: for one. changing anything will turns on the "Apply changes" button. now make other changes to different pages and eventually come back to the interface page and you will see an "Apply changes" and a "Save" at the bottom of the page. also, make no changes at all and hit the save button will also turn on the "Apply changes". IPsec is another one that has both an "Apply changes" and a "Save" button at the same time and I'm sure I've seen it in other places as well.
BTW, I'm using the old school pfsense theme if that makes a difference.
Roy…
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That is not a Save and Apply button next to each other.
If an Apply button shows up, it must be clicked in order to activate the changes. If you don't click apply, the changes won't take effect (unless you reboot…) so of course it will nag you if you go back to the screen without hitting apply.
IPsec also has apply because making changes immediate would be disruptive. We have people who have >300 active tunnels so making changes in a batch is less disruptive than immediately applying them.
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so the question is:
if I hit "Apply changes", does that also save my changes to the config file or do I need to "Apply changes" and then do a "Save"?
Roy…
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Apply never saves, it's just applying changes you already made.
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I've come to think (possibly quite erroneously) of the buttons like this:
"Save updates the configuration file. Apply processes the relevant section of the configuration file so the recent changes are also made to the running configuration."Hence one generally shouldn't see an Apply unless a Save button has been previously clicked.
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I've come to think (possibly quite erroneously) of the buttons like this:
"Save updates the configuration file. Apply processes the relevant section of the configuration file so the recent changes are also made to the running configuration."Hence one generally shouldn't see an Apply unless a Save button has been previously clicked.
agreed
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I've come to think (possibly quite erroneously) of the buttons like this:
"Save updates the configuration file. Apply processes the relevant section of the configuration file so the recent changes are also made to the running configuration."Hence one generally shouldn't see an Apply unless a Save button has been previously clicked.
That's how it works.
