Thoughts on the new "Gold" menu in 2.1.5
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Watchguard re-wrote their web interface for smaller boxes in Flash. You have to try hard to beat that. ;D
I have no problem with the 'Gold' menu heading as long as it's a place holder for future offerings. I did expect to find the auto-config-backup there but if that's being considered for general availability anyway I can see why it's not. It seems fairly unobtrusive to me.
Steve
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I really don't think pfsense is going to "end as a free product", and I don't see that anyone is going to fork and constantly patch pfsense "CentOS style" just to remove this "Gold Menu" from the UI. Nor do I believe ESF is going to turn it into crippleware, break stuff, etc just to drive sales/donations, at least there are no indications yet of that. All of these calls of doom and gloom are currently unfounded, in my opinion.
There is certainly the aesthetics concern, but just as important is the consistent functionality of the system as a whole. However with this, there is bit more to the story than "we're just adding a menu". If a good place was needed to just put some new features tied to the gold service, why not just add an item under "Services" called "Gold", and then add tabs for all the new features (both free and paid) as they were developed.
There have obviously been some further proposed changes from the GIT commit (which in fairness, were subsequently withdrawn) to further highlight, change the background colors of the images and themes and otherwise draw attention to this "Gold" menu in future releases. That to me doesn't sound so much like "we're adding features for our "members" to enjoy" as it looks like subtle, persistent advertising. Am I wrong in this view? I don't see anything wrong with promoting the service in pfsense in a non-intrusive manner (ala the initial wizard, as a link in the backup area/auto updater, or you know, Help->Paid Support) but by shoving it front and center as seems to be the goal, well you might as well wrap it in <blink>tags.
If I'm not able or don't want to use the perks of a Gold membership, either because I'm not interested or didn't pay for them (which is totally fair), why should everyone have a "Gold" main menu by default? Isn't that what the Packages system already addresses quite well? Install the "Gold Member" (lol) package, and let it do the modification to the GUI so that I can have the all the features that require a "Gold account" should I so desire, and let the unmodified "base" GUI run as a standalone system not requiring these account based features.</blink>
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I wrote "shareware" in the 90's. And, I will tell you, hiding the "donation" page in a help menu gets you 0 donations, and 5,000 support questions. That turns your hard work, that started out as fun, into a job. Put the donation information where they had to look at it? I still had the 5,000 support questions, but guess what? I got donations.
In my opinion nobody is going to see the pfSense web interface but those administering the network. Why are you worried about that? If you're running pfSense in a business, it's FREE! Nobody's going to see that <gold>but your administrators, might guilt you into contributing a minimum support contract, but you don't have too.
Either way, what does it matter? You have a group of guys/gals that are managing and pushing the development of this project and dealing with the support and want to charge for that support… Trust me the support is much harder then the development; believe it or not, it is. The Software is free for those that don't need the help. And what account based features? Auto Config Backup? that's a package you have to install.
I guess I just don't get the problem... ???
PS... I liked the <gold>menu item when it had the gold background.
If I'm not able or don't want to use the perks of a Gold membership, either because I'm not interested or didn't pay for them (which is totally fair), why should everyone have a "Gold" main menu by default? Isn't that what the Packages system already addresses quite well? Install the "Gold Member" (lol) package, and let it do the modification to the GUI so that I can have the all the features that require a "Gold account" should I so desire, and let the unmodified "base" GUI run as a standalone system not requiring these account based features.</gold></gold>
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Watchguard re-wrote their web interface for smaller boxes in Flash. You have to try hard to beat that. ;D
Challenge accepted!
I have no problem with the 'Gold' menu heading as long as it's a place holder for future offerings. I did expect to find the auto-config-backup there but if that's being considered for general availability anyway I can see why it's not. It seems fairly unobtrusive to me.
It would have been in, but I was trying to get <something>in for 2.1.5, just so we could shake-out all of the breakage before 2.2-RELEASE.</something>
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I was happy to see the Gold in the toolbar. It makes it quicker and easier to find the Gold stuff.
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People gotta eat. The button doesn't bother me.
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If a good place was needed to just put some new features tied to the gold service, why not just add an item under "Services" called "Gold", and then add tabs for all the new features (both free and paid) as they were developed.
I hypothesize that it was given it's own menu primarily to improve its visibility and differentiate the "Gold" membership services from standard packages and operating system services.
That to me doesn't sound so much like "we're adding features for our "members" to enjoy" as it looks like subtle, persistent advertising. Am I wrong in this view?
I think you are dead on. I think the Gold menu was added as non-intrusive reminder the project is in need of financial support.
I don't see anything wrong with promoting the service in pfsense in a non-intrusive manner (ala the initial wizard, as a link in the backup area/auto updater, or you know, Help->Paid Support) but by shoving it front and center as seems to be the goal, well you might as well wrap it in <blink>tags.</blink>
Except that:
A. Adding a menu is non-intrusive. (Versus say an annoying pop-up.)
B. They didn't use blink tags. (Which would in fact be annoying.)If I'm not able or don't want to use the perks of a Gold membership, either because I'm not interested or didn't pay for them (which is totally fair), why should everyone have a "Gold" main menu by default? Isn't that what the Packages system already addresses quite well? Install the "Gold Member" (lol) package, and let it do the modification to the GUI so that I can have the all the features that require a "Gold account" should I so desire, and let the unmodified "base" GUI run as a standalone system not requiring these account based features.
One could make the same case against any of the menus. "If I'm not able or don't want to use the perks of VPN, why should everyone have a "VPN" main menu by default? Why isn't it under services?"
By this same argument, if it bothers you so much, why don't you create a package that removes the Gold menu item?
What is the root of your concern? Is it only aesthetics? Surely you aren't unhappy because pfSense relies on donations to support itself financially and has reached a point in its evolution where it needs to remind endusers?
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B. They didn't use blink tags. (Which would in fact be annoying.)
Ha! Don't temp them. ;)
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What is the root of your concern? Is it only aesthetics? Surely you aren't unhappy because pfSense relies on donations to support itself financially and has reached a point in its evolution where it needs to remind endusers?
I wouldn't classify gold membership as a donation.
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What is the root of your concern? Is it only aesthetics? Surely you aren't unhappy because pfSense relies on donations to support itself financially and has reached a point in its evolution where it needs to remind endusers?
I wouldn't classify gold membership as a donation.
Why?
You are not forced to, you get the same software I do. I, as a Gold member get the pfSense book that sells on Amazon for $36.00 and it includes updates that you can't buy from Amazon. http://www.amazon.com/pfSense-Definitive-Christopher-M-Buechler/dp/0979034280/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1409526741&sr=8-1&keywords=pfSense+book. ie. Selling support? Besides, I feel much better for contributing.
Hell, the Red Cross gives T-shirts out when you contribute and, I guarantee the management of Red Cross makes more then the management of ESF. What is the problem?
Wait!!! I get it!, WHERE IS MY T-SHIRT!!!! LMAO. -
It's a membership. You get something, presumably of value, in return.
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technically (legally) "Gold" is not a donation.
As before, the "Gold" menu is a placeholder for things we're adding in the future.
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In your face "buy me" stuff has always annoyed me. However, if I can think of a cool way to ask for money, I'll post it here.
Me as well. But I don't see any problem with this myself.
To all others- Until someone finds that elusive money tree people are always going to find a way to raise money. If this method reminds a few that can afford it (those that are in fact saving a few bucks), to donate next to nothing to help support the project then Im all for it. Get Over It!
Most seem to have no problems clicking through the "your 30 day trial is over please buy now" pages that allot of other software puts up these days. That is more "in your face" than I believe this ever to be.
Ive come to find that computers are a rather expensive hobby. And doing business in this country just gets more expensive by the minute. Things I know today would make me never have tried to do my hobby as my primary job. Too many politics involved. And now I hate my hobby! no its not computers.
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Most seem to have no problems clicking through the "your 30 day trial is over please buy now" pages that allot of other software puts up these days. That is more "in your face" than I believe this ever to be.
While that would likely raise more revenue, it would also suck. A lot.
We're not doing it.
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@gonzopancho:
Most seem to have no problems clicking through the "your 30 day trial is over please buy now" pages that allot of other software puts up these days. That is more "in your face" than I believe this ever to be.
While that would likely raise more revenue, it would also suck. A lot.
We're not doing it.
Please don't think I was suggesting that… Just making a comparison.
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Oh :o.
And I thought this was an added value for those with the wide-screen patch in a >2.2 environment, fills up the menu a bit more ;D[…trying to add some humor here, this thread needs it!...]
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To everyone at ESF and to the Pfsense community,
Thank you so much for developing this software! And moreover, thank you for giving it away for free! I have no issues with the Gold item on the menu. It does not bother me in anyway! I was a bit surprised to see it there but again it does not affect me in anyway whatsoever!
Please continue to keep up the good work. Look forward to newer and improved versions!
Ken
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To everyone at ESF and to the Pfsense community,
Thank you so much for developing this software! And moreover, thank you for giving it away for free! I have no issues with the Gold item on the menu. It does not bother me in anyway! I was a bit surprised to see it there but again it does not affect me in anyway whatsoever!
Please continue to keep up the good work. Look forward to newer and improved versions!
Ken
This. Personally I don't care about this at all and I really don't get all the commotion about it. As soon as they put a picture of cmb in a string on the frontpage, I'm considering posting a comment about it on the forum :). The software is solid, wellmaintained and free. Let them do what they want with their gold membership. It's not intrusive at all.
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The first thought that came to my mind was why did that menu only have one item in it. It's like it wasn't even worth making it a menu. Just put it in the help menu. For now it's just taking up space. People will donate when they feel comfortable doing so.
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@gonzopancho:
Knowing full well I'm probably in the minority, I'm going to speak up.
Aside from some theme/font formatting issues, the addition of the "Gold" menu doesn't bother me. It's not telling me to "Buy Gold," rather it's just "Gold" as a menu for where I might find paid features. pfSense has had a commercial support offering with some extra features for as long as I can remember, and this feels no worse.Quite the opposite. I love the $99/yr subscription, it brings project support and previously commercial-only features (AutoConfigBackup) within my budgetary reach. So in at least one instance, the "Gold" menu will pay off for pfSense, and I'm happy to do it.
I'm actually considering bundling ACB into pfSense. You would still need a (free or higher) portal account to use it (because that's how it works), but it would be free to use.
Thanks for your comment.
And yes, the formatting issues are … a bit tragic. We'll work out the issues, and the menu will get populated with services that people who run pfSense can take or not take.
:o is that means i can use it with free account? ;D just in case for saving/restoring backups, tired to download configs to my drives…i have some experience today dealing with squid+havp+sarg+clam and other stuff like that...but something get messy after i doing some movements with guidelines that guys posted here on pfsense forums ::) and then I've broke something... ah is so great that y guys doing simple rollback in main pfsense console with backups under (15) :P this menu is just save my day cause I'm already get WebGUI lockout and ssh when play with some sort of things like havp+squid.....to hell with me! i want stable versions of squid3+havp and appropriate guide with pictures to how to setup appropriate http/https ssl filtering....
the only one thing in pfsense bother me sometimes is that pbi is simple not an option for such great distribution, i mean, what if i want to updrade something manually, once i want to install mc on my pfsense installation and got lib hell after managing to install mc from freebsd ports >:( it's kinda weird when you stick around to an old versions of software, like i installed tooday havp and find out that "freshclam" command show up to me that i have old clamd version with considering to upgrade :-X pbi is need to complex work and maintain some soft of base packages. So, I've got one question, did you guys plan or thinking about to do something about it in future releases? Even though i know that pfsense is for routers not for kitchens ;D...but sometimes ppl just want to press button and refresh some sort of software and with simple guide get it to work (I've use once a pone time ClearOS...it's nothing to be compared to their free functionality vs pfsense distribution).
Also packages system is varies from platform to platform versions of pfsense 1, 2, 2.1 or some minor versions and sometimes i got really scare about do i need to install packages from another pfsense platform versions, cause some bug in uninstallation process sometimes just leaves already uninstalled things under my services (like "system patches" package or "RIP" daemon)...
Long live pfsense! To be honest i like how the security issues of freebsd base system is reflected and cleared in late patches, I've read some patch notes under the hood and for this major distribution it is a great work for us people, i hope you know that we appreciate your concerns to do that in the future releases.
I've recently visit pfsense redmine just for fun...hopefully in this cold winter we could have pfsense 2.2 on our machines.
Sorry about my English i am living in cold Russia :'(
