Please recommend managed switch for home use?
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I have a dell powerconnect 2824, when I put it into my network I was thinking it'd have a web-interface that I could go to in my web browser and edit and configure it from there. but from what I searched it doesn't…..I got it for free so im not that upset about it, but I'd like something a little easier to configure seen as I'm still less experienced with pfsense and smart networking.
Should I look at something a little newer with a web GUI or buy some sort of work around cable so I can access the console and configure it?
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I'd recommend the Zyxel GS1900-xHP (or no HP if you don't need PoE).
They are affordable and great for home use. They include the features you are looking for and more.
You can even access it via CLI or add a console port to the header. IMO it's a sweet spot for home users looking for more room to experiment and learn.
I just ordered this Zyxel model from Amazon today.
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Should I look at something a little newer with a web GUI or buy some sort of work around cable so I can access the console and configure it?
I would at first try out to get it configured by using the CLI and if this is not your "world" and thing you may be
able to buy another one, it is for home usage and with no special concern or needs better then spending extra money.@nitewolfgtr
With the DGS1510-20 model you will be able to get 20 RJ45 GB LAN Ports, 2x SFP Ports and 2x SFP+ Ports
perhaps something to connect faster and easier your equipment, likes DMZ and LAN Switch to your pfSense
firewall or your LAN server and your NAS/SAN to the entire network, think about, mostly better then setting
up LAGs and the gain is only so minimal that you often will be nothing really see highs up in numbers. -
Thank you all for your recommendations. Although I agree the DGS1510-20 is better for future proofing myself, I think the price is a bit out of my budget at the moment. Not really looking to spend that much. Based on everyone's input, I think I will go with Zyxel GS1900. It looks like it has everything I need and the price point is great! I don't see myself upgrading to 10Gb anytime soon and really have no need for it at the moment.
Thanks again for all your help!
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I don't see myself upgrading to 10Gb anytime soon and really have no need for it at the moment.
Ok that I was not knowing, I was perhaps miss leaded by the LAG (LACP) and thought that an LAG with 2 or 4 cables
and ports will be aggregated 2 GBit/s till 4 GBit/s and the usual speed under real conditions from a 10 GBit/s interface
is also 2 GBit/s tpo 4 GBit/s pending on the used protocols and services. -
What are you talking about? A Dell powerconnect 2824 does have a web interface in managed mode. Default address is 192.168.2.1 User admin no password.
http://downloads.dell.com/manuals/all-products/esuprt_ser_stor_net/esuprt_networking/esuprt_net_fxd_prt_swtchs/powerconnect-2824_user%27s%20guide_en-us.pdf
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What are you talking about? A Dell powerconnect 2824 does have a web interface in managed mode. Default address is 192.168.2.1 User admin no password.
http://downloads.dell.com/manuals/all-products/esuprt_ser_stor_net/esuprt_networking/esuprt_net_fxd_prt_swtchs/powerconnect-2824_user%27s%20guide_en-us.pdf
well thats great then, I did see that address while googling and tried going to it, but nothing and I did an IPscan and it didn't pick anything up. (managed mode was on) maybe I have to not be plugged into pfsense and try it again?
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If you picked up a used Dell PC 2824 and do not have the necessary configuration details then the only way I know how to connect is by serial console. Use an inexpensive db9 null modem cable and putty if your computer has a serial port. You only need a few cli commands for a basic network and I find it handier than the web interface.
You may find better help in the Dell forum.
http://en.community.dell.com/support-forums/network-switches/f/866
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And, IMHO, for home use you only need VLANs. If you go further with LACP…//...thats not a home setup (and another budget).
As far as I know the majority of switches that support VLANs also support LAG and today that normally means LACP as well.
Almost every NAS, even those specifically targeting small to medium home use, have multiple NICs, LACP support and the performance to take advantage of it. As an example we can take the €200 Qnap TS-231P.
L3 switching, that I very much agree is not home use and definitely a different budget.
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The only conceivable way to utilize LACP on a small home network as I understand it would be to allow more than one user to utilize a NAS at full speed (or less speed penalty if >2 simultaneous users) simultaneously if the NAS is also configured LACP.
whether that is of any value to you depends on how you utilize your NAS, I would imagine the vast majority of home setups wouldn't benefit appreciably. -
And, IMHO, for home use you only need VLANs. If you go further with LACP…//...thats not a home setup (and another budget).
LAG is also common likes VLAN and QoS as today home networking has changed to smaller and/or mid ranged networks
or networking knowledge. As an example, in the mid 90th (95) you where happy to find someone to set up your IPsec
VPN, today they watch "HowTo´s" over that at Youtube!As far as I know the majority of switches that support VLANs also support LAG and today that normally means LACP as well.
My cheapest switches are only supporting VLANs (Netgear GS105E (25Euro) & Netgear GS108E (40 Euro)) and the LAG is
in the game play for some coins on top of their price (89Euro) with the Netgear GS108Tv2 so I consider that is more common as today.Almost every NAS, even those specifically targeting small to medium home use, have multiple NICs, LACP support and the performance to take advantage of it. As an example we can take the €200 Qnap TS-231P.
But the benefit from that LAGs mostly over LACP is smaller then the most peoples will imagine or expect from to have.
Only if one line (cable or port) is failing or gets saturated the next one will be started to use!L3 switching, that I very much agree is not home use and definitely a different budget.
Cisco SG350-10 for ~210 Euro
D-Link DGS-1510-20 ~210 EuroWhat is home budget and what not? If you are a teenager you can work and earn here in Germany for 400 Euros per
month without paying tax. So the most of the younger peoples have today more money in the pocket as we where in
the past or in former days. -
I think it's fair to say that 200 euros for a switch to handle Netflix is a bit over budget.
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@BlueKobold:
My cheapest switches are only supporting VLANs (Netgear GS105E (25Euro) & Netgear GS108E (40 Euro))…
Yes the Netgear E-series, Web Managed (Plus) switches are the exception that I know of as well, that's the reason I wrote "the majority of" instead of "all" switches.
Only if one line (cable or port) is failing or gets saturated the next one will be started to use!
Yes of course but you forgot to mention the multiple concurrent nodes, that's the main requirement for LACP to be useful.
Cisco SG350-10 for ~210 Euro
D-Link DGS-1510-20 ~210 EuroThank you, you prove my point! Over €200 for a switch is definitely not what non-geek homes spend on a switch. If as the OP they require many ports, maybe roughly half of that is a reasonable home budget.
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LAG, LACP, Etherchannel, Portchannel.. Doesn't matter what you call it..
To leverage the fatter pipe you created the devices involved have to be smart enough to spread the traffic across the aggregation.
You have clients on 1 side of switch, server on the other. Which interface does switch see the syn on, which path does he send that to the server on? The hash used to determine the path is what is going to determine if you can leverage your extra bandwidth and how much of it you do.
How many servers how many clients.. Your 1 client is never going to see more than 1 gig to that server no matter how many paths you aggregate together.. Now if you have lots of clients all talking to the server at the same time, then ok.. Server will be able to push out more than its 1 gig if his other stuff can handle it, cpu, nics, disks, etc..
My point is in a home this rarely makes sense - your burning ports that many homes do not have, and your not going to see any performance increase. And now you have a way more complex setup. If your running a server for your dorm or something, or you have a bunch of people in this house all using the same server with fast pipes.. Ok.. How many clients are there? What exactly are you doing - sorry but streaming even 4k does not require that gig pipe.. You can serve up lots of clients over the 1 gig connection. Are you moving files back and forth to this server were more than 1 gig makes sense? Ok then - prob time to move to 10ge on that server..
That is my 2 cents on the subject.
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The only conceivable way to utilize LACP on a small home network as I understand it would be to allow more than one user to utilize a NAS at full speed (or less speed penalty if >2 simultaneous users) simultaneously if the NAS is also configured LACP.
Correct.
whether that is of any value to you depends on how you utilize your NAS, I would imagine the vast majority of home setups wouldn't benefit appreciably.
Being a member of a NAS forum that different from this forum is populated by far more normal users than geeks or professionals, I notice the main usage for home NASes being storing and streaming of multimedia and as backup destination. More and more also use it as storage for some constantly writing surveillance cameras (at least full HD today).
In a home with more than 1 person, especially when there's also kids around, there will on evenings easily be several concurrent clients of a home NAS and with 1 active computer, 2 hi-res media streams to smart TVs and/or tablets and two surveillance cameras, single gigabit NAS connections will at times be a bottleneck.
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I'm not knocking setting up an LACP on your home network - I have an LACP on my home network (that I don't need).
I'm just pointing out that it is probably not going to be a significant improvement on a home network.
I tihnk most home networks can find times where an LACP prevents a bottleneck that would otherwise be there. i.e., the above home NAS setup with a few users trying to transfer files at the same time. The LACP may well allow three users to DL @ ~600Mbps instead of ~300Mbps, but 300Mbps is still moving a gig every 30 seconds. So while yes it can be a speed improvement on home networks, not many home networks will see an appreciable time savings over time. But then again most of us do a whole lot of things on pfSense that we don't need on our home networks haha, so have fun!
One home network scenario that probably could benefit a lot from LACP would be a network that does a lot of work with video editing via a NAS. That stuff, especially high resolutions before compression can really suck down some bandwidth. If you are regularly transferring 20-30GB+ files around, an LACP could really help keep your transfer speeds up without tanking the LAN for everyone else.
There is something to be said for cost with LACP too. In the above video editing example you can improve network speeds with a few more GbE ports (cheap) and a couple of Cat5-6 patch cables.
Upgrading to 10GbE, while certainly a faster/better solution requires you to buy at a minimum 1-2x 2-port 10GbE NIC's, plus a 10GbE switch - not cheap! -
"single gigabit NAS connections will at times be a bottleneck."
Doubt it to be honest.. For starters I agree with you multiple devices in a home - most of which are Wireless!!! So these devices are not even capable of gig.. 2 hi-res streams.. Ok - how much bandwidth is that??
4K is what 15Mbps, to 20.. Netflix I think says preferred 25.. Not so much that is what it uses. More that what your pipe is so you can do other stuff in on the net in the background.. What content are you streaming that 1 gig can not handle 2 streams with plenty of room to spare.. Lets call it 50Mbps per stream… Still leaves you with about 800mbps when we call out the actual real world 900mbps you will see on that gig wire..
So unless your moving LARGE files.. filling up the pipe with a backup from some machine that can saturate the pipe for long time.. like TB of data being moved.. if you are moving TB of data to your NAS.. My guess is that would be taxing the thing more and causing any sort of slow downs vs your gig pipe being a issue.
What disks are in your NAS.. Running SSDs in a raid 0? ;) What can the disks do sustained across the wire?
"If you are regularly transferring 20-30GB+ files around, an LACP could really help keep your transfer speeds up without tanking the LAN for everyone else. "
If you are doing this from multiple devices all the time Then ok gig might be an issue, if your nas can actually push/pull what your gig pipe can move and your nas is not the bottle neck.. But you need multiple clients doing this all at the same time, and over a wire not wireless to start to stress your gig pipe where it becomes your bottleneck and you could leverage lag or moving to 10ge..
10ge can be done on the cheap quite often.. Connect your nas to your switch with fiber and an sfp+ in your switch.. Depending on your switch 10ge sfps can be dirt cheap, and a fiber connection for your nas shouldn't be all that expensive either..
Ubiquiti UniFi 10G MM Fiber SFP Module 850nm LC UF-MM-10G (2-Pack)
I see for 40$..Can you not then pick up say a Mellanox Connectx-2 card and then all you need is the fiber and your nas is connected at 10ge to your switch to serve up multiple 1 gig clients at full wire speed. Pretty sure those Mellanox nics will take almost any sfp+
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I have 2 of Netgear GS108Ev3 in my network. While they are performing their job pretty good I noticed slow management web interface responce or even seen some web pages corrupted. I noticed people here mentioned GS108Tv2 - are they any better?
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For starters I agree with you multiple devices in a home - most of which are Wireless!!!
Smart TVs and media players are more and more connected by wire and the wireless clients are ac.
So unless your moving LARGE files.. filling up the pipe with a backup from some machine that can saturate the pipe for long time..
That's exactly what NAS users do. Typically there's one computer using a full gigabit in larger bursts when doing backups and moving media files. When that hits the streaming, complaints are heard from other parts of the house. That's when NAS users come to the forum asking about LAGs.
What disks are in your NAS..
My home isn't typical as we rarely stream anything but Flac audio for longer times and we don't have any 4k-capable clients yet but I have 4 disks in RAID 5. Those that store video content often have more than 4 disks in RAID.
What can the disks do sustained across the wire?
Sequential access like streaming and backups is easily 2*gigabit both read and write on a 4-bay home NAS with low cost mechanical disks.
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I appreciate all the knowledge everyone has and has been sharing, but now you're all just bickering. lol and totally playing the do what I say; not what I do.
you're all saying no one here needs LAG…but then you have it implemented on your network... Remember we are all here because basic and just good enough is not an option for us...thus why we're building extreme machines just for routing data packets.
I for one will be setting up a LAG connection to my future UnRaid server, even though it's just me and soon to be one more using it. Simply because I can and have an extra quad port nic sitting around. I've never done it and would like to dink around with it and learn. and use it that way till I have 10gb all around.
