Watchguard XTM 5 Series

chpalmer

The Watchguard XTM 5 series uses an automatic Fan speed control.
So manual lowering the fan speed is not needed.

Grtz
DeLorean

Yep! "Mine was set for 070 and 055" those are the temps in Celsius that the box will adjust to.

PFseb

@chpalmer:

@PFseb:

Quick question, in the flashed bios, y default the setting is thermal control.
While on thermal control using WGXepc the fans still are like a hurricane.
~~Do I need to change this setting, can remember it was stated that they should be on "full speed".~~ (Btw all settings in the BIOS are now editable, I had to clear the BIOS before I could enter. Any recommendations on default values or default is good?)

Other ideas, since full speed is not the way to go…

Take any commands to control the fans away from WGXepc. Not needed.
CPUFAN Mode Setting            [Thermal Mode      ]**                        *
*   CPUFAN TargetTemp Value      [065]               **                        *
* SYSFAN Mode Setting            [Thermal Mode      ]**                        *
*   SYSFAN TargetTemp Value      [050]               **                        *
Mine was set for 070 and 055. I dropped them back 5 degrees each and may go even further if the weather gets to warm. My firewall is quieter than the switch fan mounted in the same rack. :)

Will try tomorrow, but quieter than other stuff in your rack :o :o :o
I have a switch from HP, modified with an 160mm fan, its like a mouse (so quiet).
Have a MD1000 from Dell which is standard a hurricane, modified with 4 noctua fans, the discs now make more noise.
Have a Dell R710, busy with converting with new fans etc (and home designed noise control -> PCB and programmed IC) -> discs are bnoisier and the cpu is idle 40degrees -> Xeon

So may be you definition of quiet is against stock rack equipment :D???

But as said I will test tomorrow, at the moment I only notice that the case fan is "Off" and the CPU fans are still at the RPM set by the BIOS, the WGXepg is not doing anything? (based on the command with the additional commands)

chpalmer

@PFseb:

Will try tomorrow, but quieter than other stuff in your rack :o :o :o
So may be you definition of quiet is against stock rack equipment :D ???

the WGXepg is not doing anything? (based on the command with the additional commands)

I have a Dlink DGS-1024D that is not the quietest switch in the world. Im going to replace it soon as it is a few years old and just too noisy.

WGXepc will do nothing for your fan speeds on an XTM box.

PFseb

Well I will make the modifications later this week (i hope to get the fans by tomorrow) and will post the results here (if someone else wants to modify).
My experience is that a low noise 40mm is capable of running these boxes at an acceptable temp.

Reasons for the fans used by manufacturers, is probably the MTBF and the high flow throughput (jet engine).
I.m.h.o. these procs are allowed to become 70 degrees when stressed and I think this box will never reach that with the new fans. Keep you posted.

Btw 1: what will be the purpose of WGXepc on a XTM box (if it does not regulate the fan speed)?
Btw 2: why did you take the XTM out of commission?

chpalmer

@PFseb:

Well I will make the modifications later this week (i hope to get the fans by tomorrow) and will post the results here (if someone else wants to modify).
My experience is that a low noise 40mm is capable of running these boxes at an acceptable temp.

Reasons for the fans used by manufacturers, is probably the MTBF and the high flow throughput (jet engine).
I.m.h.o. these procs are allowed to become 70 degrees when stressed and I think this box will never reach that with the new fans. Keep you posted.

Btw 1: what will be the purpose of WGXepc on a XTM box (if it does not regulate the fan speed)?
Btw 2: why did you take the XTM out of commission?

1. WGXepc is still used to control the "Armed" light on the front of the box.

2. I didn't. My first XTM5 series box is running my primary business location with 4 different subnets and multiple OpenVPN connections coming into it. Its got a quad core proc and 4GB ram in it now. It actually replaced an X-core E box that ran here for about 4 years and now does residential service for a clients house. I donated it to get them back online after an issue with their service.

Ive just picked up two more XTM's and have set them up and distributed them among friends.

PFseb

Been reading and scanning through this thread, but haven't found a lead concerning modification of the existing PSU.
I have seen some notices concerning installing a PicoPsu, however this is feasible, it is quite expensive (a kit costs you 75 euro in Europe -> 150W is the only one with a 4-pole ATX).

So in parallel to modifying the case & CPU fans I need to do something about the power fan.
Any experience, otherwise I will post (hopefully) this afternoon my complete mod. I have to say new fans is really a very very very big improvement.

chpalmer

@PFseb:

So in parallel to modifying the case & CPU fans I need to do something about the power fan.
Any experience, otherwise I will post (hopefully) this afternoon my complete mod. I have to say new fans is really a very very very big improvement.

Im looking into this for mine right now. I want to run more off the battery bank direct than just powering a UPS.

http://www.powerstream.com/DC-PC-12V-300I.htm Just the cost has got me reconsidering. :o

PFseb

Why? That is a use PSU for a low demanding environment, you will be better of with the PicoPSU, which is half the costs.
But I think it will be even easier to just modify the current sPSU with a resistor on the FAN V+

Furthermore, the downside of the PicoPSU is that it leaves a hole on the back of the unit, so you need to "invent" something there. And besides I have no idea what will be the "benefit" of running a Pico versus electrical costs versus investment.

PFseb

Had been busy with this is parallel to my normal work (I did not have so much time, because I had hoped to have it finished).

However, my preliminary findings (pictures will come when I find the optimal solution):

Replacement of case & CPU fan is a huge success, this eliminates a lot of noise (understatement);
PSU fan can be modified, but it is in general noisy, currently thinking to go PicoPSU, currently investigating the options -> modifying PSU fan is not wortth the hassle in time (to investigate & find -> low noise replacements do not exist)

What PSU power would be correct, the one currenly build in is overpowered:

CPU=35W (Celeron
3 Fans = 0.48W*3=1.5W
Mobo = 25-40W
Mem=2~5W (orginal XTM 520 mem)
Enclosure = 5~10W (estimate)
Additional HD = 3W

This mean a total of 94.5W when all components are working at max performance.
From PicoPSU the following kits can be used (net yet tested myself):

picoPSU-160-XT + 192W Adapter Power Kit
picoPSU-150-XT + 150W Adapter Power Kit
picoPSU-150-XT + 102W Adapter Power Kit
picoPSU-120 + 102W Adapter Power Kit (not recommended because you need an additional cable to convert a molex to a 4 PIN ATX)

Update 5-4-2016:
I got my hands on a picoPSU-150-XT + 102W Adapter Power Kit for 50 euro, which is quite a OK deal in Europe. Tested it yesterday and the box is super duper quiet. However when you have the box in thermal mode once in a while the fans spin up, which is not preferable. Better it is to have the fans by default spin a little faster than they do in thermal mode, in general the CPU will be cooled better and will never reach the BIOS threshold. Currenlty thinking of a way how to adjust.
(Probably by putting the fans in super fast mode in BIOS and adjust the speed with a resistor)
I hope to test this afternoon.

Now I will see where I can get my hands on, to test this in my Firebox.

uknownme123

Upgraded to version 2.3 with an ouch.

"Package LCDproc-dev does not exist in current pfSense version and it has been removed. @ 2016-04-13 01:36:28"

Will be lurking and snooping around, will post possible fix. Unless someone already found it.

Looking at packages, no LCDproc nor LCDproc-dev available for 2.3 yet.

uknownme123

Looks like manual install lcdproc here:

https://forum.pfsense.org/index.php?topic=44034.525

Looking at the hits on this thread, we should add LCDproc and LCDproc-dev as packages soon.

PFseb

Just a quick question because I could not yet find it so far. But can I use the ports of the XTM 520 to do a switch function?
It has 6 Gbit ports, 1 is for external (WAN), the others I would like to use for the same internal network (this removes an additional switch)
(Where or how can I do this?)

Found it: https://forum.pfsense.org/index.php?topic=48947.msg269592#msg269592
(Missed it the first time)

chpalmer

@PFseb:

Just a quick question because I could not yet find it so far. But can I use the ports of the XTM 520 to do a switch function?
It has 6 Gbit ports, 1 is for external (WAN), the others I would like to use for the same internal network (this removes an additional switch)
(Where or how can I do this?)

Found it: https://forum.pfsense.org/index.php?topic=48947.msg269592#msg269592
(Missed it the first time)

Just keep in mind that's not really recommended. I do it here with two ports but only use those as VOIP adapter ports. The adapters never communicate with each other over the bridge.

PFseb

Could only find that it impacts performance, not read (yet) any other negative effects.

zemerick

Has anyone installed a full install of Linux on one of these ? I want to turn this into a NAC since it has so many NICS. The only downside is it requires a 'full' Linux installation.

mandi1970

question what are the 3 conectors on th pcie side i asume 1 is the second com poort ?

kix

I have an XTM 505, not quite sure what I can do to rescue it yet. Here's what I know so far. The SSD was reporting ATA Status 51 errors. And a tech inadvertently zeroed out the root :o

I replaced the SATA cable just in case there was something wrong with the old one.

So it basically will let me get into BIOS, but obviously there's nothing to boot. I only have a SanDisk 256MB and Centon 16GB CF on hand. Tried loading pfSense onto the 16G since it won't fit on the 256MB, still didn't boot. It does seem like the BIOS is editable, though. So I'm wondering if this was flashed already since everything I'm reading here says it would be readonly otherwise. But definitely doesn't seem to like larger CF cards.

What exactly should I do to be able to boot from the embedded CF card? Try 2G/4G? Apparently NO local stores carry cards that small anymore, but I can have one overnighted. Couldn't I put a smaller OS image on the CF at least to get it to boot up from the 256MB (if that's the issue) so that I can put an OS back on the root drive of the SSD? This is our one and only firewall for a small business, so I'm definitely interested in getting her back up and running soon.

Thanks for any help.

AlexJamesHaines

Since my last post in February I have tried several times to get the system running. I have installed pfsense from a CD iso on a laptop and then moved the drive over to the XTM after the reboot phase.

Whilst connected with Putty I get lots of output and then finally boot seems to hang on:

ada0 at ata2 bus 0 scbus1 target 0 lun 0
ada0: <samsung 850="" ssd="" evo="" 120gb="" emt01b6q="">ACS-2 ATA SATA 3.x device
ada0: Serial Number S21UNSAG436895Z
ada0: 300.000MB/s transfers (SATA 2.x, UDMA5, PIO 512bytes)
ada0: 114473MB (234441648 512 byte sectors)
ada0: quirks=0x1<4K>
ada0: Previously was known as ad4</samsung>

And I can not access it via web interface either (I assume because it hasn't loaded).

This is booting from an SSD and it seems to be running WG BIOS V1.2.

Any ideas?

P.S. I also got the following:

pcib3: <acpi pci-pci="" bridge="">irq 17 at device 28.1 on pci0
pci3: <acpi pci="" bus="">on pcib3
em1: <intel(r) 1000="" pro="" network="" connection="" 7.6.1-k="">port 0xac00-0xac1f mem 0xfe7e0000-0xfe7fffff,0xfe7dc000-0xfe7dffff irq 17 at device 0.0 on pci3
em1: Using MSIX interrupts with 3 vectors
em1: The EEPROM Checksum Is Not Valid
device_attach: em1 attach returned 5
pcib4: <acpi pci-pci="" bridge="">irq 18 at device 28.2 on pci0
pci4: <acpi pci="" bus="">on pcib4</acpi></acpi></intel(r)></acpi></acpi>

A search showed me this thread -> https://forum.pfsense.org/index.php?topic=110634.0 but I would assume I need to get the dam thing to work before I can fix that. Could this be what is hanging the XTM boot?

P.P.S. I tried installing to the SSD on the laptop in AHCI and compatibility (IDE) mode but neither seems to work.

chpalmer

Read this?

http://www.triebwerk23.de/joomla/index.php/firewalls/watchguard-xtm-5-xtm-505-515-525-545-pfsense-64-bit

Or at least looked at the pictures? ;D

AlexJamesHaines

Thanks chpalmer. I had previously looked through that but I can't find anything that will help me. As I say, I can't do anything after that final bit of output about the SSD. I can't type :(