Watchguard XTM 5 Series

t-rexky · Mar 10, 2018, 7:32 PM

I started tinkering with this a little bit and have a question. Have you essentially extracted and "disassembled" the DSDT using the Intel iasl compiler, then edited it to include the new P-states, then re-compiled and re-inserted into the BIOS? I am doing all of my tinkering from Arch Linux so overriding the BIOS supplied DSDT at boot time for testing purposes would be quite easy…

I also loaded Windows 7 onto the box and I got really weird results while testing Speedstep: CPU-Z shows the multiplier changing dynamically between 6.0x and 8.5x on my Q9505s CPU, but at exactly the same time HWiNFO64 shows the multiplier fixed at 8.5x and voltage fixed at 1.2V.

It all seems to work consistently on my "PC" which is an Asus P5KE, despite that board not officially supporting the Q9505s. I pulled and disassembled the DSDT from the P5K to see how it dynamically detects the CPU power states, as opposed to hard coding the table specific to one CPU only...

@stephenw10:

What's really annoying is that I did once have it sort of working. I had to override the DSDT table with one I had added P-state values to though.

Problem is it's so long ago now I can't remember exactly what I did. ::)

https://forum.pfsense.org/index.php?topic=43574.msg265760#msg265760

Steve

stephenw10 · Mar 10, 2018, 9:49 PM

You can include a different DSDT table at boot in FreeBSD too so I did not need to insert it into the BIOS. But other than that, yeah.

@https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=acpi&apropos=0&sektion=0&manpath=FreeBSD+11.1-RELEASE+and+Ports&arch=default&format=html:

LOADER TUNABLES
Tunables can be set at the loader(8) prompt before booting the kernel or
stored in /boot/loader.conf. Many of these tunables also have a matching
sysctl(8) entry for access after boot.

acpi_dsdt_load
Enables loading of a custom ACPI DSDT.

acpi_dsdt_name
Name of the DSDT table to load, if loading is enabled.

Before you can do that though you need to enable the speedstep MSR in the BIOS and if I recall correctly it is locked so you need to change the speedstep lock register (or prevent it being set). I did that in my modified bios.

Steve

t-rexky · Mar 12, 2018, 3:42 AM

Just a quick update:

I did a bit of experimenting from Arch Linux with a standard XTM515 box (factory BIOS and factory CPU). I can confirm that in BIOS 1.3 speedstep MSR is is indeed locked, but it is already set to 0x1 by default! So no MSR changes are required at all.

I also fiddled a bit with changing the FID and VID manually by means of the c2ctl utility. I just switched FID and VID from their allowable MAX state to MIN state and run a "benchmark" in each state. The CPU is definitely behaving correctly in each state and there is a corresponding performance change reflected in the benchmark results. So speedstep control does function correctly.

When I have more time I will repeat the same test while monitoring the box power consumption to see if there is any difference.

And then I will make an attempt at cutting a modified DDST to see if it works.

stephenw10 · Mar 12, 2018, 1:03 PM

I was unable to see any measurable power consumption difference difference when I did it but I came to the conclusion that because the processor supports deeper halt states that may be masking any effect Speedstep has there.

Steve

t-rexky · Mar 13, 2018, 3:20 AM

@stephenw10:

I was unable to see any measurable power consumption difference difference when I did it but I came to the conclusion that because the processor supports deeper halt states that may be masking any effect Speedstep has there.

Steve

Right, you are absolutely correct. First, here are my results with a stock unit running minimalist installation of Arch Linux:

| XTM515 State | Power [W] | Power [VA] |
| OFF | 2 | 6 |
| Booting | 63 | 63 |
| Idle (Speedstep HI) | 46 | 47 |
| Idle (Speedstep LO) | 46 | 47 |
| Load (Speedstep HI) | 81 | 82 |
| Load (Speedstep LO) | 59 | 60 |

In other words speedstep has absolutely no power consumption benefit near idle state. It has huge benefit when the cores are pegged, of course, but this would defeat the purpose. So the real benefit would be in the intermediate performance states where the CPU is under partial loads - the system can then trade-off some performance for lower power consumption. Mind you, this is probably a realistic typical operating state for a firewall appliance, so having it functional may save some energy in the long run…

I might redo the same test on my upgraded unit with 4GB RAM, Q9505S CPU and Intel SSD320, just for kicks.

Peter.

stephenw10 · Mar 13, 2018, 1:23 PM

Ah nice result. :)
For many people a low to intermediate load is where a Core2duo is likely to operate most of the time. I had thought it might be of some benefit there.

Did you add P-states specific for your CPU? I recall I had some difficulty finding the 'official' values but there were plenty of suggestions on both overclocking and underclocking forum threads.

Steve

t-rexky · Mar 14, 2018, 9:43 AM

Thank you :D

This was all done by setting the registers manually. I made an attempt at a custom DSDT yesterday and it was a total failure. I then realized that even if I decompile and recompile the factory DSDT with no changes it does not work. It completely messes up the box, as in network ports are not recognized by the kernel, etc. I have to figure out why this does not work first…

stephenw10 · Mar 15, 2018, 1:16 AM

Ah, interesting I never tried that.

I definitely did have it working at one time. Failed to keep better notes. :-[

Steve

DeLorean · Mar 15, 2018, 3:09 AM

@iJay-XTM5:

Unfortunately, the unit is a bit too noisy for my home despite using WGXepc64 for slowing down the fans. The noise appears to be originating from the CPU fan(s), which I understand are controlled by the bios. Unlike the bios in other systems, this unit 's bios is dated 4/26/2010.
I'd appreciate suggestions on how to get the bios unlocked/CPU fans silenced.

If you use Y splittercables, then you can combine all the fan connectors to 1 connector,
and connect this connector to the chassis fan connector on the mainboard, then you can use WGXepc64 to lower the fanspeed as low as you want.
Keep in mind, that lowering the fanspeed too much, the cpu temp will raise under load.

Grtz
DeLorean

Billyboy · Mar 15, 2018, 2:23 PM

Hi Peter, can please you give me some more details aubout the VGA cable?
I need to have the same!

Regards

Christian

@t-rexky:

The on-board VGA header definitely works, and it works very well. I made a custom cable with a connector I got from digiKey and it's been extremely useful in playing with the box. The front USB ports work well with USB keyboards and mice as well, so the box becomes a fully functional PC with on-board video.

Cheers,
Peter.

iJay-XTM5 · Mar 17, 2018, 2:31 PM

@DeLorean:

If you use Y splittercables, then you can combine all the fan connectors to 1 connector,
and connect this connector to the chassis fan connector on the mainboard, then you can use WGXepc64 to lower the fanspeed as low as you want.
Keep in mind, that lowering the fanspeed too much, the cpu temp will raise under load.

Grtz
DeLorean

I was initially hoping to have independent control of the fans based on temperature, but perhaps I can get to a balanced medium.
Thanks for the response, I'll get splitter cables ordered.

iJay

wildio · Mar 23, 2018, 6:21 PM

Hi everyone! Thanks for all the info in here. With it, I've managed to convert an XTM 515 to a very nice Sophos box. However, I keep getting stuck on upgrading the memory. I've tried everything I see here and nothing is working. Does anyone have a link or part number for the memory I will need? Would be super awesome! Don't think Amazon is going to let me return anything else for another 10 years probably.

stephenw10 · Mar 24, 2018, 12:19 AM

"Just worked" with whatever I've put in it though I've never tried to get it to run 8GB. Not sure I've ever tried 4GB either, I just used what was at hand.

Currently running 2x Nanya NT1GT64U8HB0BY-25D, 1GB 2RX8 PC-2-6400U-666.

Steve

wildio · Mar 24, 2018, 12:42 AM

@stephenw10:

"Just worked" with whatever I've put in it though I've never tried to get it to run 8GB. Not sure I've ever tried 4GB either, I just used what was at hand.

Currently running 2x Nanya NT1GT64U8HB0BY-25D, 1GB 2RX8 PC-2-6400U-666.

Steve

Thanks, Steve! That helps a lot. That's different than what I've been trying to use.

t-rexky · Mar 25, 2018, 1:30 AM

@Billyboy:

Hi Peter, can please you give me some more details aubout the VGA cable?
I need to have the same!

Regards

Christian

Hi Christian,

Sure. I originally wanted to make an adapter cable but then decided that it was not worth it since I'd be only using it temporarily. So I ended up cutting one end off a standard DB15 VGA cable and soldering the pins to a connector that was not meant to be soldered to. If you do the same, make sure that you remove the pins from the connector before soldering to avoid the plastic meting. The connector I ordered was DigiKey P/N 609-2736-ND. It is the right type to fit the board header. When you make the cable, the pinout to use is as follows:

| **DB15 pin ** | Header Pin |
| 1 | 1 |
| 2 | 3 |
| 3 | 5 |
| 4 | N/C |
| 5 | N/C |
| 6 | 2 |
| 7 | 4 |
| 8 | 6 |
| 9 | N/C |
| 10 | 10 |
| 11 | N/C |
| 12 | 11 |
| 13 | 7 |
| 14 | 9 |
| 15 | 12 |

Hope that helps,
Peter.

mahave · Apr 3, 2018, 2:28 PM

have just grabbed a watchguard xtm 515
Has thrown a 60gb hdd into it to pfsense.

has tried to put "pfSense-CE-memstick-serial-2.4.3-RELEASE-amd64.img" onto the CF card. When it's loaded, it's get stuck on line: Trying two mount root from ufs: / dev / ufs / FreeBSD_Install [ro, noatime] …

Full log: https://pastebin.com/Q5eitjBZ
Sometimes I do not get any console output and just a black screen after bios screen. Where it does something behind it can i see on the cursor.

The bios is the stock "WG BIOS 1.3"

Have tried to format the disk, second disk, look in bios for settings (view only mode ..)
Have tried to load "pfSense-CE-2.3.5-RELEASE-4g-amd64-nanobsd.img" into hdd - but without success and stuck in last line - Log: https://pastebin.com/ahY7NgsP

What can i do to put pfsense 2.4.3 on the watchguard?

stephenw10 · Apr 3, 2018, 4:09 PM

That's the point where it switches to the primary only console. Are you sure you used the serial memstick image? If you have used the standard VGA image that's exactly what you would see.

Steve

mahave · Apr 3, 2018, 5:33 PM

@stephenw10:

That's the point where it switches to the primary only console. Are you sure you used the serial memstick image? If you have used the standard VGA image that's exactly what you would see.

Steve

It is the memstick serial version i have used :/

t-rexky · Apr 5, 2018, 3:05 AM

@stephenw10:

Ah, interesting I never tried that.

I definitely did have it working at one time. Failed to keep better notes. :-[

Steve
[/quote]

Well, this was a pretty steep learning curve but I can confirm that I now have a modified DSDT that fully supports SpeedStep on the stock CPU. And yes, I can confirm that SpeedStep does indeed work as intended.

I also fiddled quite a bit with C states, but the chipset really only supports C1 in a desktop configuration, so there is absolutely nothing to be gained in terms of idle power consumption: 46W at idle is it! Earlier today I had a Eureka moment thinking I can get lower idle power by enabling CPUSLP#, but as it turns out it is already enabled. Besides, I think the CPU actually drops into C1E state when idle so the power consumption gets as low as it possibly can already. But, of course, I could be talking out of my orifice since I really don't quite know enough about this.

My original issue with DSDT failing was Linux related: I was using a DSDT override method that is apparently no longer supported. Switching to Grub based override of DSDT fixed that issue. Next step for me will be to create and flash a custom BIOS image with the modified DSDT. I intend to create two versions: one for the stock CPU and one for my Q9505S CPU.

corvey · Apr 5, 2018, 12:23 PM

@t-rexky:

Well, this was a pretty steep learning curve but I can confirm that I now have a modified DSDT that fully supports SpeedStep on the stock CPU. And yes, I can confirm that SpeedStep does indeed work as intended.

I also fiddled quite a bit with C states, but the chipset really only supports C1 in a desktop configuration, so there is absolutely nothing to be gained in terms of idle power consumption: 46W at idle is it! Earlier today I had a Eureka moment thinking I can get lower idle power by enabling CPUSLP#, but as it turns out it is already enabled. Besides, I think the CPU actually drops into C1E state when idle so the power consumption gets as low as it possibly can already. But, of course, I could be talking out of my orifice since I really don't quite know enough about this.

My original issue with DSDT failing was Linux related: I was using a DSDT override method that is apparently no longer supported. Switching to Grub based override of DSDT fixed that issue. Next step for me will be to create and flash a custom BIOS image with the modified DSDT. I intend to create two versions: one for the stock CPU and one for my Q9505S CPU.

From what I remember using my old firebox, the stock power supply was very inefficient. It wasn't until I switched to a picoPSU and an efficient Toshiba laptop power brick that I saw the wattage drop from 45-50 watts to 25watts.