I didn't mean that I submitted the user certificates to acme, I actually had the CA key "intermediate cert I guess" that I had as a result of a previous certificate certificate that acme returned to me for pfSense and about a half dozen other hosts downstream. Valid, no BS, I still have a legit key+cert that I can sign new public certificates with, it expires July 14. Anyway, I am just using self signed for everything. I managed to find the intermediate and server certs I created in Cert Mgr in freeradius3 /usr/local/etc/raddb/certs. I compared the keys I downloaded from Cert Mgr against the keys there, sure enough. Used intermediate to create new server cert on second box counting down to avoid certs with same serial number. It would sure make things earlier, but I guess that's the point sort of, but if someone is smart enough to gain access to the OS then they are smart enough to find them, it just took me a lot longer because I am not very good at this. I will surface again shortly on free radius post, not having any luck with certificate authentication, pswd auth is good though. See ya there Jimp, thanks for the advice.