What would you choose between these 2 mini-itx fanless systems? (J1900 vs N3150)

Mithrandir

@Mithrandir:

APU2 is 180Euro full bundle: enclosure, 16GB mSata SSD, power supply and board.

where please?

http://varia-store.com/Hardware/PC-Engines-Bundles/APU-2C4-Bundles/APU2C4-Embedded-Box-Bundle-1GHz-4GB-RAM-3x-LAN::29135.html

It's almost 200E now. Was 180 when I was ordering last week.

curtisgrice

Of the two, I would get the Qotom Q190G4N-S07. Unless your pushing 100+mbit over vpn I would not thing twice about the AES-NI. Also Intel NICs WILL save you time and hasel down the road. I have had some many issues with realtek nics (esp. multiport cards) doing completely asinine things, its just not worth messing with them in any server/router platform.

Personally, I got the 2440 Netgate box and LOVE it. Its been rock solid and I know it will be supported 100%

jimp

I am definitely biased but I wouldn't choose either one of those, for a number of reasons. :-X

bingo600

@jimp:

I am definitely biased but I wouldn't choose either one of those, for a number of reasons. :-X

Care to elaborate a bit please ?

I'm a pfsense newbie , just considering my first install
https://forum.pfsense.org/index.php?topic=127036.0

If i like it , i have been eyebaling the "black" one , as i only need VPN for "home" usage.

/Bingo

messerchmidt

would go n3150

bingo600

@messerchmidt:

would go n3150

Might do so too , but the "Box" shown has realtek IF's.
Some users here says that they have problems with getting the 2'nd IF to forward packages.

/Bingo

lansmurf

Have you also taken a look at the Shuttle DS67U ? It is fanless, has got two Intel Nics, and a Celeron 3855U CPU which supports AES NI ! https://ark.intel.com/products/92211/Intel-Celeron-Processor-3855U-2M-Cache-1_60-GHz. This processor is according the benchmarks in the same leaque as the N3160.
I am considering this one besides the Zotac CI325 but the CI325 has Realtek NICS :( …

icest0rm

@jimp:

I am definitely biased but I wouldn't choose either one of those, for a number of reasons. :-X

thanks jimp, can you please detail the reasons so I can follow you? :)

Waqar.UK

@messerchmidt:

would go n3150

I am thinking of buying the n3150, but as someone pointed out, new Intel goldmont CPU's are coming out. Realtek has been proven to work with the current vesion of pfsense but what is the through put? Is it stable gigabit wan and lan?

psensible

Get the Quotom (disclaimer, I am using one happily).

AES-NI, according to anything I've managed to read on this forum, is an extremely dubious advantage for your typical smaller scale setup.

10W vs 6W is utterly trivial in terms of power savings.

Why buy yourself NIC compatibility problems with the N3150 option?

Waqar.UK

@psensible:

Get the Quotom (disclaimer, I am using one happily).

AES-NI, according to anything I've managed to read on this forum, is an extremely dubious advantage for your typical smaller scale setup.

10W vs 6W is utterly trivial in terms of power savings.

Why buy yourself NIC compatibility problems with the N3150 option?

Fair enough.

But: "AES-NI, according to anything I've managed to read on this forum, is an extremely dubious advantage for your typical smaller scale setup."

Can you point where please?

VAMike

@Waqar.UK:

But: "AES-NI, according to anything I've managed to read on this forum, is an extremely dubious advantage for your typical smaller scale setup."

If your bandwidth is low enough, anything modern can keep up using openvpn. AES-NI is only really a factor if you're doing higher speeds (but: those are becoming more common, which is why it's talked about so much here). If you have no chance to upgrade past a 50Mbps connection for the life of the hardware, it's a non-issue.

icest0rm

@lansmurf:

Have you also taken a look at the Shuttle DS67U ? It is fanless, has got two Intel Nics, and a Celeron 3855U CPU which supports AES NI ! https://ark.intel.com/products/92211/Intel-Celeron-Processor-3855U-2M-Cache-1_60-GHz. This processor is according the benchmarks in the same leaque as the N3160.
I am considering this one besides the Zotac CI325 but the CI325 has Realtek NICS :( …

this does cost around 500 euros here :(

bingo600

@icest0rm:

@lansmurf:

Have you also taken a look at the Shuttle DS67U ? It is fanless, has got two Intel Nics, and a Celeron 3855U CPU which supports AES NI ! https://ark.intel.com/products/92211/Intel-Celeron-Processor-3855U-2M-Cache-1_60-GHz. This processor is according the benchmarks in the same leaque as the N3160.
I am considering this one besides the Zotac CI325 but the CI325 has Realtek NICS :( …

this does cost around 500 euros here :(

I see them on ebay for around 300$ (+ Ram & HDD)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Shuttle-Ds67u-1-6Ghz-3855U-Bga1356-1-3L-Sized-Pc-Barebone-DS67U-/401281338907

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Shuttle-DS67U-1-6GHz-3855U-BGA1356-1-3L-sized-PC-Schwarz-PC-Workstation-B-HY614-/352003310020

Not often prices goes up (Recommended retail 226€) , maybe thats wo. VAT
http://www.cdrinfo.com/Sections/Reviews/Specific.aspx?ArticleId=48834

This one looks interesting too , dual intel NIC
But has fans) , and i suppose no CPU.

Shuttle XPC slim DQ170
http://www.shuttle.eu/products/slim/dq170/

/Bingo

motific

I have pretty much that exact N3150 box and it has been fine certainly since 2.3, no packet loss issues or other problems that I'm aware of (so far) - I'm currently on the 2.4 development builds. I've given it a big list for pfBlockerNG to chew on and it's very happy.

Personally I wouldn't bother with the wifi in your firewall, give that work to a dedicated access point instead.

Intel NICs are the way to go though, irrespective of if the realteks are (or are not) any good they get a lot less driver support and are likely to be the first thing to cop the flak should a problem occur and they're not top of the pile should a fix need doing as the community mostly use Intel. Certainly they add some extra overhead to the CPU where the Intels tend to have a lot more built-in capability.

I went with the N3150 box as I needed an HDMI display output but would have been better off with the J1900 and Intel box in the long run.

pfBasic

@VAMike:

@Waqar.UK:

But: "AES-NI, according to anything I've managed to read on this forum, is an extremely dubious advantage for your typical smaller scale setup."

If your bandwidth is low enough, anything modern can keep up using openvpn. AES-NI is only really a factor if you're doing higher speeds (but: those are becoming more common, which is why it's talked about so much here). If you have no chance to upgrade past a 50Mbps connection for the life of the hardware, it's a non-issue.

It could still be useful in low bandwidth applications if you are trying to do a lot with the box.
In an ideal scenario you would buy just enough machine to do what you need seamlessly, in which case AES-ni would still matter.

But in reality we just about all have hardware that dramatically outclasses our needs so yeah, then it doesn't matter.
Most of the modern low end hardware recommended for 50Mbps connections is really powerful relative to those needs, even the cheapest stuff.

psensible

@Waqar.UK:

@psensible:

Get the Quotom (disclaimer, I am using one happily).

AES-NI, according to anything I've managed to read on this forum, is an extremely dubious advantage for your typical smaller scale setup.

10W vs 6W is utterly trivial in terms of power savings.

Why buy yourself NIC compatibility problems with the N3150 option?

Fair enough.

But: "AES-NI, according to anything I've managed to read on this forum, is an extremely dubious advantage for your typical smaller scale setup."

Can you point where please?

You'll have to do a forum search, or a google search using the "site:pfsense.org" option. There were a fair number of hits. I looked at this mid last year then stopped worrying about it.

Waqar.UK

Thanks.

kroem

@chrcoluk:

I own the N3150 unit which is very nice, however please read below.

Others who own this unit reported only one of the 2 realtek NIC's working, I confirmed the same problem on my unit. I have removed the wireless capability, so detached the aerials and removed the wireless card, replaced it with a dual port i350 intel NIC, and with the intel NIC's I added the unit is superb.

Someone on kitz forum uses the other unit and he is very happy with it.

The latter unit is better out of the box for sure, but the N3150 is perhaps better if you willing to add a intel addon card.

Hey, that's pretty interesting, changing the NIC, is there some guide or recommendation how to? :)

Guest

None of them I want to go with! I personally would bring in the game these two units here also well known working and 100%
compatible with pfsense.

till 500 MBit/s WAN
APU2C4
16/32/64 GB mSATA
compex wle200nx or UBNT SR71-E

over 500 MBit/s WAN
Jetway NF9HG-2930
8 GB RAM
16/32/64 GB mSATA
compex wle200nx or UBNT SR71-E

For both or all units "nullmodem cable (console) and USB to Serial Adapter"
Well know working without any hassle and problems.

Not the newest products but reliable and stable running.